I'm guessing the majority of the writers on here are in their early to late teens. I've read some pretty intense stuff from extremely young writers. It makes me feel pretty lame compared to them. Like Bagatelle and Society's Cavity. Whatever happened to them anyway? I miss their stories.

It also helps if you understand the English language and know how to use spell check and use proper grammar. Nothing pisses me off more than someone who posts something just to get attention. And there have been at least 2 "stories" on here posted just for that purpose. I remember one of them got major reviews just because it was short and stupid.

Hey, to whoever remembered the Cartman and Kenny slash? Was the name Bathroom Sex Revisted? I do remember that one. I think it was by Jonestarr somebody or other. Another example of a good slash. But it's not on here anymore.

It makes all the difference. Nothing turns me off more than that. I once gave crit to an author who was mixing up your and you're and the response I get:

Thank you so much for showing all the sentences. My teacher doesn't teach us that in school.

That's not an excuse for not using a grammar check, but when I read that a little part of me died.

Nothing pisses me off more than someone who posts something just to get attention. And there have been at least 2 "stories" on here posted just for that purpose. I remember one of them got major reviews just because it was short and stupid.

I hate that so much!!!!

I have posted stories in other fandoms and mine never get as many hits or reviews as the crappy ones, something I never understood. Granted, I love that fact that my reviewers are coherent, but I just don't understand all the attention.

Indirectly, age does matter though. Older people will tend to have more experience, simply because they've had more time to experience these things.

True. The younger writers could be good at bullshitting though. I do it all the time. ;)

The younger writers who happen to be awesome are just ahead of the curve.

Exactly. I know some excellent writers out there who are thirteen or fourteen.

Good bullshitting can only really come from indirect experience though. A virgin might be able to write a good erotic story, but not out of thin air; s/he has to at least have heard about sex in order to properly bullshit... otherwise you get the poker scene from 40 Year Old Virgin. So basically if you're gonna BS something, then you'd better at least be knowledgeable in theory if not practice.

Wow, I fell like I'm posting on here way too late... :O

Honestly, it isn't just South Park that has problems in terms of fan fiction. I've looked through Sonic fanfics and found some really shitty stuff there. Mind you though, writing and posting random fanfics can be okay, just don't do it a lot. One might actually be enough.

Crossovers can actually be good, but if they don't act as they seem in their original show (ie, I'm planning on doing a Gundam Seed/ South Park crossover, and if I was to put Kyle, or technically a decendant - sorry if that's misspelled - and start making him act exactly like Athrun, then it wouldn't seem real. Instead, someone would think that it's just someone who looks similar to Kyle, but in reality he'd be another Athrun Zala. Which, honestly, Gundam Seed doesn't need.), then it's pretty much just putting a "look-alike" character in, as opposed to putting the full character in altogether.

Flames, on the other hand, are useful. The only time they aren't is if the person's litterally bashing your work/ you without giving any advice at all. Some people though just might dislike flames, in which case it'd be better just to give them advice while trying to be as kind as possible. Yes, I have actually read fics with fairly minor problems, though I'm mainly taking it that they don't have any sort of spell check or something, so I just don't bother. Crappy summaries, on the other hand, maybe because the whole summary is too long to write in the actual summary box, or they just haven't had that "perfect" summary pop into their head. The ones with spelling mistakes and whatnot though are ones that are pretty much saying, "don't read this," though these people honestly need someone to help them out with their fanfics. Sure, they may very well be horrible, but if no one who actually knows what to look for in a proper fanfic reads them, then they can't get any sort of review telling them to fix stuff in their work. In the end, that will cause more shitty stuff to pile up on here. And therefore that will cause more people having to look even harder to find something decent on here.

Age, on the other hand, doesn't have much to do with it. I've seen someone the same age as me (that being 15 right now) write some really impressive stuff, even though it wasn't fan fiction. But honestly, it depends on how well you can write yourself. If you're a really horrible writer and you fully know it, then either don't post your stuff, or get a beta reader to read it. And if you happen to post something on the site that isn't great and you get someone giving you advice (even if it's a little harsh), then take it as a sign that at least someone had the kindness to read your story, and use whatever he/ she said in your next fanfic. Don't go sending them a message bitching at them for being an asshole or something when they're trying to help.

Last but not least, the whole "write what you know" idea, as well as slash. I myself enjoy reading slash, though I have actually read stories that involve het couples, as well as stories without any couple at all. either way, those that write slash don't make it that believeable, so such people should either stop writing it or look through some good slash stories and see if try to make something as real-sounding as said stories. On the other hand, just because someone writes slash as "something they know" doesn't specifically mean they're gay. They very well could be bisexual, and likewise with the het writers. Either way, those writing on what they know are more likely to write more better than one who doesn't, mainly because they have experence with such a thing and can put that into their story. While Style (or Stan/ Kyle) fics seem to be the most common thing here, I've noticed a fair few involving Butters and Kenny as a couple, which seems to be growing in popualarity. I've seen a few Kyle/ Cartman ones, though a fair few end up bringing in the whole "Nazi" concept (in the series, Catman is viewed to be like Hitler due to his attempts to rid the world, or at least South Park, of the Jews and so-on.). Either way, there just happens to be some couples that are believeable, while others are just plain strange. And, coinsidentally, Stan and Kyle seem to be the most common slash couple, even though this has caused a major amount of Style stories, and a lot of them are horrible. Some of them don't have the slightest explanation of how anything might of started between them, and they could just start making-out right at the start of the fic. Weiiiiiiird.

So, this would be the end of my extremely crazy (and long) rant. And to put it simple, I think most fandoms have gone to hell, but there's always a chance to revive them. :)

I can't help but partly agree. Even though lately there's only been 1 person who was written some really bad fiction (or could I even call it fan-fiction) and has also stolen numerous titles from other categories. I'm not naming any names, but now the person has even come to a low level as to post reviews using very obvious names on one of their stories. It really is pathetic.

I started reading SP ffiction recently and it really disappointed me (I mean really, really, really) There are slashes all over the place and you just don't recognise the characters anymore. Don't get me wrong, I don't have anything against slash lovers (writers or readers) I like reading slash too but not about SP. I like SP because the characters are the way they are and when somebody comes and changes their personality for whatever reason they just seem to say "don't read this".

Spelling mistakes...they don't bother me so much, maybe because I'm not English or American so I tend to make mistakes myself and as long as I can figure out what the writer meant it's OK but bad writing...that's a different story. If someone wants to write a SP story then they should make it look like SP and don't just use the SP characters' names to make a random story (that just might not be interesting at all).

And if anyone here knows a good SP story please tell me because I want to read it. (Thanks in advance)

Yea, I know what you mean. I have just reacently come here and while I wasn't expacting great fanfiction. I am also suprised by the amount of yoai fanfiction on here. When did the show ever state that these boys friendships ever when beyond friendship. The real thing is, I don't think that romance really fits into south park.

The bad thing is that most of the (good) people have already packed their bags and moved on. Well can't be helped.

Here is one good story I have found. http://www.fanfiction.net/s/4599130/1/That_Future_Thing

Yeah, I can't understand why people find it interesting to make the boys older and gay. And even if they're not gay some couples are just impossible to imagine in the old SP, like Cartman/Wendy.

Thanks for the link, I'll try it.

Is it just me or am I noticing more and more SP stories with OC's in them?

Well I have noticed a few OC stories pop up and to be honest, I am sort of planning my own OC story. However I plan on making that story have a plot rather than the 'How does my OC cope with south park?'

While I am hear I think I will complain about the OC I hate the most (its really the only OC I know) its an OC called Jacob "Mutt" Duncan by an author called "Mutt13." The reason? Its not the OC itself, its that somehow this OC's presence seems to warp south park and make Kenny, Stan, Cartman and Kyle act out of character! Cartman..... doesn't act like he should (can't describe how), Stan and Kyle seem to hate Kenny and Kenny is emo.

When I have the time I think I will inform the author in this latest story 'Pinkeye 2: The evolution' of what I think of his character (and also post some constructive criticism about the story, flaming isn't my style).

Does anyway have stories/OC's that they hate?

Yeah I did point it out to him that they were totally out of character.

There is another story, I forgot which, where one of the chapters just contained the OC's and none of the actual south park characters in it. Doesn't that just ruin the whole concept of 'Fanfiction'?

Thanks for the link DarklightZERO. That story was really good. I'm really glad that there are some good stories around here and authors who can write SP without making it totally OOC.

Mutt isn't usually as bad as he was in PE2. That was my fault, I was supposed to be reviewing it all in advance for Mutt and I let some stuff through the cracks. And you're really judging Mutt based on one story. It's being rewritten to have MUCH less OC focus and much MORE IC, so it doesn't matter now.

The fandom is in hell.

South Park slash is... it's not there. It makes almost no sense. Almost every character has been shown to be straight at one point or another, and the only gay pairing with any seeming base in canon (CartmanKyle) has been defeated. Slash is okay in small doses, but there's so much of it flooding the fandom it drives out the good het authors, and the OC authors. But what pisses me off lately is how the more vocal slash authors act. Not all slash authors are like this, I'm friends with some, but there's a few that leave reviews on any OC story they find calling them Mary Sues and saying "pair them with anyone but an OC." That's a double-standard in my opinion. I really don't feel slash authors have a right to criticize the OC genre just for not using canon characters, considering there is no proven slash in South Park aside the adults.

I'm also really sick of "Don't like, don't read." I understand what it means, but when 9/10 stories is slash, that's almost the same as saying "Don't read any of these." And there is good slash, but 75% of it here is cliched and badly written. Kenny's always bi - even if he ends up with a chick - Stan or Kyle is always nervous it'll ruin their friendship, but at some point they randomly kiss. Cartman wants to rape Kyle for pretty much no reason. Wendy acts like a total OOC bitch. Craig and Tweek always hook up. There's exceptions, but not very many.

Now I know people like to jump on the OCs, and I have noticed a boom in OCs. I don't mind it as much because OCs began the South Park fandom in a sense (I've been through a LOT of older FF sites for SP.) and to be frank, I find it much more plausible new people will come and fall in love with the boys than they suddenly go gay for each other. A lot of the small more Sue-like OC stories don't end up lasting and the more lasting OCs such as Lucy and Ivy are not Sues. Mutt hasn't gotten decent exposure and John - my own character - is a Stu, which is why I am killing him off as soon as I can (outside of "The Story With No Plot" because he's pretty much supposed to be a Stu in that one.)

There's no OCs I hate that are still in use, there's no specific story but I hate mpreg. I used to be okay with it, but when I commented on a fic on another website using mpreg on how it wasn't making sense and wasn't possible for a virus to have those effects I got over 200 bits of hatemail over it so now I really HATE mpreg. And almost all main boy slash pairings, even more so than slash with side characters or with one side character and one main boy - KennyButters, StanKyle, KyleCartman, etc. don't rub well with me.

I could care less about slash, because I always suspect it would be before I even click the link to view. A few years ago, I did get angry because I never thought someone would pair them up. After having a look through them, some are really well written and some of them don't even have a kiss.

It's really up to the authors on what they do with the characters and you always have a choice to read on, nobody is forcing you.

Thats why I'm not saying much about the OC stories. Do whatever the hell you want with them, I just won't click the link. The only thing I do not want to see is a huge explosion of generic OC stories pop up. Alls fun in being in the show you love but please don't let the imagination run too rampid.

JVM-150, I judged Mutt's character on Mutt story "Story of Mutt." (I can't be bothered to see it that is really the name) Anyway, CASE CLOSED!!

Anyway I think this fandom has sunk past the 7th level of hell that even Beelzebub, Damien and Satan would require a 10 foot long pole to touch it. As I said before I think that south park has been only about one thing. Comedy. Romance should come secondary to comedy in my opinion.

The only OC fics I avoid are the "Please suggest OC to go into this" because that tells me that the author has little to no idea where the story should go, it also tell me that any OC's that are accepted wouldn't progress that far in personality and character.

Well after my exams this week, I should be free to make my own stories to inject into this fandom.

P.S. I am just curous, but has any one seen any stories where either Pip or Butters get paired up WITH A GIRL! All I have seen are gay pairing involving those two.

Looking forward to those stories

And to answer your last question, I have seen a few stories of them paired with girls. I remember reading one where Pip was paired with the girl from his own episode in Season 2 and Butters with the girl from the Raisins episode.

I tried to search for them but I ended up with a load of Damien and Pip and Butters and Pip.

...I'm not going to argue. Mutt does not make characters OOC, except S+K in PE2.

And yes, I've paired Pip up with Sally many, many times, although I don't use Butters much.

I try to do Comedy, but the problem is that people such as myself who actually understand the Comedy try to write it but just aren't... funny. I don't find any of my own fics funny, which is why I'm stopping in a few months.

As far as I'm concerned, the South Park fandom died in 2001. That's when all the good authors left. Mutt13 and Tweek's Panda are the only two active authors I know of who have been watching for more than two or three years. And you, Darklight. And that's including myself, I only started in 2006. I feel very lucky I'm in contact with a few of those older writers, and I will say... "I'm glad to be out of there."

Dear DarklightZERO, just had to reply to this to defend myself as a writer and creator of Mutt. Since you couldn’t tell me in my face how much you hated my OC. I won’t bash nor insult that’s not my type but I will say that I don’t think you’ve really read Mutt’s Story because none of the South Park characters are out of character Kyle and Stan are basically the same as they are on the show and Kenny’s neither emo nor shun by them in this fanfiction, if you can re-read and find examples of this in Mutt’s Story please tell me so . Cartman is the easiest one to put into character because he’s always an asshole to everyone basically and reading that you said that he is out of character shows but I’m just guessing that you haven’t watched South Park that much. Me I’ve watched it since 98.

I agree that I did place Kyle and Stan out of character in Pink Eye 2 however and I did have a reason behind it and was going to post it in the next chapter but reading your beautifully written critique and discussing it with JVM-150 we decided that it indeed could use a re-write. Kyle and Stan hating on Kenny was a tad extreme, I just needed a reason to justify zombie Kenny readily attacking them in the re-write I might make it that the virus is so strong and mind controlling that Kenny readily attacks anyone friend or foe. Kenny being emo only because well he was a zombie and zombies aren’t normally happy folk besides that Matt & Trey hardly ever emphasis on his true personality the only thing I’ve gotten from the show is that Kenny has a perverted mind and uses drugs nothing else, I don’t want to make him single minded now so does he act emo or not is anyone’s guess but I don’t normally make emo as his personality. Again Cartman is not being out of character he’s just being Cartman, again he’s always an asshole to everyone including his friends I mean just look at how much he hates on Kyle and he has hated on Kenny too, “I hate you Kenny”-SP:BLU.

And to defend my character Mutt, if I don’t no one else will except JVM-150(thanx by the way), I didn’t nor do I intend to make his presence warp anybody’s character everyone is basically the same before he even came to South Park and I aim to keep it that way ,in fact I try to keep it that he’s part of the group but not the group he doesn’t, won’t replace anyone, he doesn’t have any crushes on any girl really he’s just not interested, and I try to make it that he doesn’t hog the stage so to speak. And with that I am out oh another thing I’m a “SHE” not a “HE” thank you and have a nice day. :)

I really wish you OC story writers could be more imaginative with your stories. Thats me come across another OC fanfic entitled "Welcome to South Park" written once again in diary format. Maybe I should do one:

Welcome to south park #564

Dear diary. I am moving to South Park because I am a troubled child and my dad got a job in a town that is so generic in every way. Boo I have multicoloured eyes and I got a super kawaii personality disorder! I'm gonna wear my blue jeans and my t shirt even though its freaking below 5 celcius. I am Stans 500th cousin and Craigs 200th.

OMG Kyle is totally hot I'm gonna pair up with him and oh wait, all the bad stuff is happening to me!! Only my super boyfriend who magically loves me can save me!! And Wendy is such a bitch for some reason so I hate her!!!!!!!

How do you like my story guys? I don't have much imagination so gimme OC's to add to my story so i can become popular!! YAY! xdxdxdxdxdxd

Over the top I'm sorry. But thats really how I see every OC fanfiction.

See, this is why I dont write stories on here. I can never seem to "please" you guys for I will get something like. "ZOMG THIS IS HORRIBLE" or "GTFO N00B"

also my writing ability sucksass.

Flames like those are things to be ignored. However, if a number of people don't appear to like your stories, it may be because they either have too many grammar, spelling or punctuation errors or that there isn't enough character development. I haven't read your stories, but some basic rules to remember include:

Capitlisation: Every name, place name or beginning of sentence must begin with a capital letter. Entire sentences typed in capitals are not encouraged because an exclamation mark (!) works just as well.

Spelling: Use a word processor with spell check and use it often. Microsoft word also has grammar check but that sometimes makes your sentences sound too complicated, but a spell check is an essential before posting anything.

Apostrophes: Words like don't, won't and can't - shortened from do not, will not and cannot where there are missing letters - must have an apostrophe.

Beta: If you don't have much confidence in your own writing, try out a beta reader. ffnet offers a number of people who have signed up to be beta readers and are waiting to help with new or less experienced authors. These guys are the ultimate in spellcheck, and they can offer helpful plotline advice as well eg. if you need more character development or if the plot is moving too slowly etc.

Summary: Your summary has to draw the attention of a reader. Not to say it should all be in capitals, but they don't want to know if you suck at summary writing, or that they should review. It should contain a short overview of the entire story, with any main character pairings at the end. As a personal preference, I tend to avoid stories that have the sentence "but what happens when" in them, but that's just me.

If you want harsh but constructive criticism then ask for it. The people of the site who want to see it a better place will point out weaker areas and congratulate the areas that have been done well. But when people say "OMFG DIS FEEC SUXORZ" they should be ignored or blocked.

As far as OCs go, they can't become Mary Sues or Gary Stus - OCs which are perfect in almost every way - for example, having a group of girl versions of the boys who are so beautiful that the boys fall instantly in love with all of them is a no-no. In fact, focusing the story around these OCs and having minor cameos from the main cast is also a bad thing to do. Fair enough devoting a chapter or two to the development of your character, but an entire story is too much.

Every OC is not a Mary Sue, Pururu, but so many of them are that most people believe that. Make them flawed, give them a short temper, an annoying personality or maybe even freckles that don't make them 'cute'. DO NOT give them an abusive past, unless it is a major plot point.

I hope this has helped a little.

OBEY THE FIST!

VIVA LA RESISTANCE!

Don't knock it till you tried it.

I've come across many people who have just joined ff.net and their writing skills were not perfect. But then they practiced, kept writing and some of their stories turned out wonderful!

Sure you'll get the occasional flame or two, but doesn't that make you want to strive to become even better?

Also, we do not need to please, write for fun! Its your story after all, why should you only do something if it was only to please a couple of people. You may have the most popular story in the whole archive and not feel happy writing it.

The point I'm saying is don't let other people badly influence you to write because its not suited to their taste, just enjoy writing.

Okay even if I DID write for fun. I still would be horrible at it. I would probably get the south park kids out of character or make my OC's who I dont believe are mary-sues because Ivy has several flaws I can easilly twerk her to make her non-mary sueish as possible. If I wrote about her I would most likely fall into a mary-sue trap.

:sigh: I need a Beta -_-'

also another problem I have. I dont know how the hell you guys upload stories on here.

I love South Park, I love FF.net, I read both Slash and Het and enjoy many different pairings. I even like a few OC-stories, but this is getting ridiculous.

When I checked out the front page today, eight (of 25, that makes a third) of them were OC-stories with summaries like Pururu's (the one you described, not one of yours), and half of them said in their summaries that they wanted more OC-characters. I didn't look inside, but I sure one or two of the others accept them as well. That's more like onesided roleplaying than fanficiton if you ask me.

I don't know about you, but I read/write fanfiction because I like the characters, not only as they are now but also how they were when they were younger and how they will (possibly) be when they are older.

And as many of you have already said, I'm not refering to any story in particular by saying this and there are quite a few good ones out there. This is just my general opinion.

Oh shit, now everyone's going to hate me. :S

What you said is true. OC stories are growing in every inch of this archive. I've always wondered what triggered this eruption.

So I decided to take a look around the archieve: A 1 chapter normal friend save friend fanfic - 1 review. A 6 chapter OC story with male pregnancy - 27 reviews. Another 6 chapter OC story and accepts OC characters - 41 Reviews.

The way OC stories are treated now in the south park fanfiction, it does feel tempting. You get instant reviews and an easy to write story. I could care less about the OC stories, but I do hope they're remembering to include some of the south park characters. I'm surprised fanfiction hasn't made an OC category yet.

It was started over I Love Lucy, an actually well-written OC story that features many canon characters. The problem was, everyone wanted to copy Lucy. It's like after Star Wars came out when everyone was making Sci-Fi movies. The original was good, but the clones suck most of the time.

I'll admit there's too many OCs, but a lot of people who complain about them generalize the entire group. Not every OC story is a bad shittily-written mashup. Kootie Bomb's OC stories are both excellent.

Also, where is this OC mpreg story? I've seen a six-chapter mpreg story, but no OC one.

"The way OC stories are treated now in the south park fanfiction, it does feel tempting. You get instant reviews and an easy to write story."

Easy to write? My ass. It sounds easy to write but it's actually pretty hard at times to write based solely off a character profile, and it's also hard to balance it because OC stories have to balance twice as many characters as canon writers, even without OCs.

"I could care less about the OC stories, but I do hope they're remembering to include some of the south park characters."

I try to use the South Park characters more than OCs in all of my stories (The Story With No Plot being an exception, but that's 1 out of 40 stories) and I know other authors like Kootie Bomb and Mutt13 give a lot of attention to canon characters as well. However, I will agree a lot of OC stories ignore the canon characters aside from the basic love interest function.

The point I'm trying to get across here: There's a lot of OC stories now and yes many of them suck, but don't generalize all OCs and OC stories as bad.

Plus, you have to remember, OCs were the origin and root of the fandom until only a few years ago when slash emerged.

Edit: Pururu's summary is close, but I don't see a lot of multi-colored eyes and the cousins idea seems to have been phased out lately, and Kyle has been replaced by Kenny and Tweek for the boy who gets the most love. I'll admit those are mostly nitpicky details though.

I'll give you all this: my OC was basically a Gary Stu, I'm currently reworking him to be reintroduced sometime later.

http://www.ponylandpress.com/ms-test.html is a good test. I think all authors should take it.

I have seen some really good OC stories, and I know that some chracters aren't as far-fetched. I was looking at a majority of stories I had read before. I mean cheek to talk from me, I had an OC in my first story.

To be honest, I think it is good at they're writing stories, OC or not. They're actually writing, experiencing and improving. I think thats great.

Also, there is a story I've been writing that eventually have non canon characters in it and a love interest that im pretty much concerned about. They're minor roles and im trying not to take them too far into the story.

Thats pretty much all I have to say. I've probably passed off as an ignorant so and so blasting on about the OC stories like the're the plague so I apologise.

As I'm sure somebody has already said the cure for bad writing is to review it. The way I see it there are two kinds of writers around; those who can take criticism and those who can't. If you write badly and are criticised about it you're either going to accept it and (hopefully) improve or you're going to take it badly and be less motivated to write (badly) again. problem solved.

Good grammar has never really seemed like that much of a big deal to me, I think that if you find a good story with bad grammar you should obviously tell the author but you shouldn't let it get to you. I wouldn't let a 'there their' ruin an otherwise perfect story, pay attention to the words not the grammar. In my opinion even the most ridiculous out-of-character writing can be justified in the story. If chapter 1 starts with a massive orgy which is never explained in any way... well that's just stupid. If however chapter 1 starts with a massive orgy which is later explained in the story... well that's still a bit weird but acceptable in my view.

I haven't really been around long enough to say whether or not Fandom has gone to hell but I can say that it could definitely improve.

God I love ranting

Every group of people on this fandom, the slash authors, het authors, OC authors etc. all have a select few who give them a bad name. Slash does have perverted fan girls writing lemons and these select few make it so a lot of readers think all slash authors are like that. Het has the homophobic slash-haters who flame and go on and on about how slash is wrong. OC has the mary-sue and gary-stu people who like to make themselves into the ultimate character who gets everyone to fall in love with them.

My point being, most of these groups are fine upstanding authors who love to write and accept everyone else's opinion because they are entitled to it. But because of the select few, I fear these groups will carry on being victims of stereotyping. This is why the fandom is falling apart.

Ranting IS fun. :)

OBEY THE FIST!

Cool guys to be sure. But please, call me 'Blue Streak'. :)

OBEY THE FIST!

No problem, I get it all the time. :)

OBEY THE FIST!

This was an incredibly interesting multi-page rant. I typically avoid anything rantish that might trend towards negativity, no matter how enjoyable the vent, because it almost always devolves into useless dogmatic cursing and shouting. That said, I'm glad I peeked in at this one, the arguments, [or agreements for the most part] were actually convincing to a degree, and lacking in the normal (ears plugged, shouting matches.) I may have even had to rework my opinion of OC users, slightly. I do confess that I have always found those stories to be my particular anathema, perhaps because I ran into far, far, far too many Mary Sue stories early on. It became so bad that before I even submitted my first story I agonized for weeks because I had run into 'unavoidable' OC's and was debating dumping the story simply to avoid it. I eventually worked my way around it but only by creating an ironclad set of rules strongly limiting the activity, use, dialogue, etc of said OC's. And ever since I've lived by that rather dogmatic and blindly tunnel-visioned system. Especially when it came to 'skipping' stories outright if OC was even mentioned in the summary.

That embarrassing confession off my chest, I suppose I'm only interrupting your argument to wonder of you more OC inclined writers, what do you consider the 'line that I shall not cross,' with OC's? I'm very curious as to see what restrictions/boundaries you place to keep the story from devolving like those early OC ones I had the misfortune of reading. Not to imply that OC stories have to devolve, (though I did believe that once...but consider me reformed!), merely wondering what you consider bad OC and how you avoid it.

On a separate note, I'm afraid I may have been to strict with the whole never considering OC centered stories, not in writing for myself, I know where my style and preferences lie, but in reading the works of others. It seems from the persuasive arguments posed here, that there are very well written, enjoyable OC stories that I might have accidentally overlooked in my personal vendetta against that sub-genre. Might someone point me in the proper direction of a few? I'd go blindly hopping around and peeking, but I know if I pick wrongly and end up reading another six or seven, "Hi this is me, I'm amazing, everyone love me, oh my gosh I'm so super, let me solve/cause everyone's problems as the ultimate protagonist/antagonist!" stories I'll be right back into the old OC-hating mindset of yesterday.

The only other topic broached I find myself confounded by is the whole review concept. While I know it is the responsibility of the reader to guide the author towards a better mindset, I find myself singly unable to post a bad review. Partly because as I went to school to be an Enginerd (not mispelling but an affectionate nickname), I find the idea of myself guiding anyone towards better writing positively laughable. Also because I find it hard to tear apart something someone found the courage to post. Lord knows it took me so very, very long to work up the nerve to post any of my early stories. [All slash I'm afraid, but I find it so very hard to write a het pairing, not out of distaste, merely perplexity and extreme lack of experience. A person whose trained and prepared themselves as a writer might be able to switch mindsets and cover unfamiliar territory, but blame it on the technical side of me, but I find it hard to breach into the het mindset. Plus...I kind of take umbrage that there were so few cartoons growing up where characters with my orientation were around to identify with and find that when I have the freedom to take digital pen to glowing computer screen I use the opportunity to write a story for those who might have felt similarly isolated by the lack of early youth gay couples.]

Moving beyond that brief aside and back on to the topic of not being able to write bad reviews, I should clarify. I hardly go around singing the high praises of the downtrodden and muckity muck stories. If something is bad I move on quietly, praying the next is better and remembering to avoid that author's new stories for a month or two. If it's absolutely apocalyptic, [i.e. entire stories underlined and italicized, showing no understanding of the enter key's magical ability to break paragraphs into sentences, a butchering of the spoken word, or an unnecessary abundance of dialogue sparsely interspersed with poorly defined actions and no basis for those actions/reactions] I simply go turn on something classical, pick up a story by an acclaimed, highly paid, 'professional' writer and attempt to remind myself that bad stories aside, the next generation of author's can't all be horrible. There must besome hope for the future of the written word.

I realize that does a disservice to the author, who could assuredly use some gentle guidance, I simply don't find I have the talent or motivation to provide such soft corrective maneuvers. And someone who offers a grain of useful commentary hidden within a paragraph of rude wording is wasting their time, unless they only wanted to type the review to avenge the time they wasted reading the story, [interestingly enough wasting MORE of their time...] The simple truth is a good reviewer and by that I mean talent at reviewing, not necessarily one who writes glowing or positive reviews, is simply to rare a thing. And a very unrewarding position at that. I can't think of something on-line that would be LESS fulfilling than posting well thought out, constructive, intelligent, USEFUL criticism, only to have the entire thing ignored because it accidentally singes the author's pride or has its impact reduced by a dozen vapid smiley face comments that follow, etc.

Worse for the beleagured reviewers, no one ever reviews reviewers, or at least I'd imagine it doesn't happen often. I can't help but feel sorry for such a thankless position. I know, I've tried to send a few personal messages of thanks along the way to those who have provided insightful observations on my stories, even the negative ones, but I can't imagine that most author's do. Simply because the number of reviews on some stories would get to an exausting level of review, reply, counter-reply, and at some point you spend more time writing replies once you have enough stories up than you spend happily chasing plot bunnies down rabbit holes for your next story. I only have the time because I a) write slowly to begin with, not producing enough stories to get bogged down and b) am a small fish with a small subset of stories, around less common topics who is happily swimming in a tiny little corner of a big pond. All that adds up to there never being enough reviews to make replying a time consuming task.

That said when I do review, I simply highlight two to three things about the story I liked, usually pulling examples, simply because I feel an author would like to know that someone reading caught and appreciated their good works. I just can't do the same thing with negative reviews though, I balk at the idea, get flustered, and just keep it positive, or say nothing at all depending on the stories overall quality.

I don't know where that last part went really, I was going to say something along the lines of "go reviewers!" you guys are unappreciated masters in a thankless job. Instead I ended up getting lost in rambling on the nature of a good versus bad review and the damage it causes. I guess rambling is a good sign I should tie this up now!

Wonderfully thought provoking observations made in this forum so far I quite enjoyed them. I wish I could come away from more forum threads feeling as informed/reformed as this one left me,

Much love,

Sky

Since I respect and admire all the authors here I've got a favor to ask you all. Would someone read and critique my first OC multi-chaptered fic? I really need some honest feedback so I can improve it. Thanks.

http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5273879/1/The_Ballad_of_Bad_Guys

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