He makes me so mad D

[] Light is justified as a character.

[] Light was L's genuine friend.

Possible Spoilers, read at own risk.

Alright, first off. If I were anybody in the Manga, it would easily be L. I share the intellect of Light, where it is my belief L is more intelligent; however, L shares my morals, love of sweet tasting things, and way of sitting. (Yes I always crouched. Now, if my parents died...and my middle name does start with L....Can I be L? PLEASE?!?! TAKE ME WHAMMY HOUSE!!!)

Anyway, Light is quite possibly the strongest, most true to life character in the anime. He sees clearly and makes human level mistakes. He falls for traps and has a different perspective depending on the stuation. He has a strong sense of justice, which is twisted to his own personal justice, but every human has their own sense of justice. I believe it is not my place to judge people, but to know right and wrong. However, it is also my belief, that if I find people to break the rules of others, especially those that endanger other for any reason, that person sh be judged. Again, not my place to be the judgeand jury. Light, on the other hand, developes a form of God Complex, in the sense he reaches a divine level of judgeing people. He no longer cares, with Death Note memory, whether or not people suffer. It is from the level of divinity that he believes that any trying to kill him is trying to kill justice. From this, Light believes those tracking Kira deserve to die also. (The movies, in this view, are somewhat a poo bases for these statements.) Also, remember that it is not truly Light who is causing him to become paranoid and psychopathic, the Death Note brings fear and Misey. And while I am thinking about it, if I were in Light's position, I would have had written in the Death Note the following before his father and the rest go into Mello's hide out:

Soichiro Yagami, after breaking into Mello's hideout, he enters a confrontation with Mello. He writes Mello's name in the Death Note, hoping that a saving grace will save him. Before dying, Mello shoots Soichiro and Soichiro dies instantly.

Secondly, Light was fully L's friend in the sincerest sense. As they became friends, Light had no remembrance of his hate for L or the Death Note, except it was evil Remember, in giving it up, all memories of it were erased.

I think that should do for now.

im sorry but my heart goes all the way to lil L =)

OFF TOPIC, SORRY: By the way, perhaps I should create a Misa discussion. She's not genius, but she's not stupid either. Just wondering.

Ukita is the guy who dies at Misa's hand...

On topic:

Actually, Light is the one who explained the concept of an adult and child with te deathnote and how Kira is an affluent child. (L did have the same thoughts though...)

*Slight spoiler questions**

Does anyone here wish Light had beaten Near?

I do, but I think it is because I agree with Light. then again, this forces me to be subjective, so I do not HAVE to support. No one else does either. If you answer you can write "Yes" or "No" You can, obviously, give reasons, but please spoiler warn for people who are behind in the manga.

*END SPOILER!!**

**POSSIBLE SPOILERS**

When Ryuk killed Raito, I was like "HELL YES!!" I never, ever sided with Raito after the killing of the FBI agents and Naomi. At first, I agreed because I thought that the world could use a few less criminals, and I wasn't too fond of the mysterious, faceless "L" character that kept popping up because Raito was doing a good thing. However after Naomi and Raye's deaths, I simply could not feel for Raito anymore. He killed innocent people (however I must admit that he was very clever about doing so), and I just can't agree with that.

Slightly off topic, but after L was finally "unmasked," I simply fell in love with him. His mannerisms and way of speaking, he was so cute :D.

*slight spoilers*

At first, I sort of agreed with Light. For me, L was an interesting phenomena whom I wanted to see. Then, when I saw him, I thought, "He's neat" until later when I strated to truly fangirl. But I disgress. As the story went on, I started actually disliking Light. He started to seem rather evil. I never actually decided while reading who was good and who was bad while reading. I kept going back and forth until reading the disscussions here. But, after a few posts in the forums here, I realized that I didn't believe in what Light was doing, that he as one person could decide the fates of hundreds of people without much information. So, in conclusion, I'm rather glad that Light lost, because I don't believe that the world could have thrived under the reign of Kira.

As for the using the DeathNote thread, I agree with Mihael Keehl. Not only would some people be afraid to use it (myself included ^^;), but remember: Ryuk didn't appear right away. In fact, it took a couple of days, if I'm not mistaken. So you have the skeptics who would probably abandon the note as well.

EXACTLY!! One man does NOT have the right to decide the fate of millions of people, regardless of their crimes. That's why we have a justice system, and not an ultimate man killing people HE thinks are bad. Like the FBI agents. They did absolutely nothing wrong except try to catch Kira, so he killed them. L too was a good guy, had no crimes EXCEPT going after Raito. Mello, Near, Matt, Naomi, all the same story, save for Near still being alive. Mello died because he kidnapped Takada, Kira's spokeswoman, and for that he deserved to die (and also because Raito had a previous vendetta against him for a] taking his sister Sayu and b] taking the Death Note. But more b, cause Raito really only used his family, hence his father's untimely death, and taking the Shinigami eyes.) And Matt died (though not by Raito's hand) because he was helping Mello work against the Kira faction.

Did Raito have the right to have those innocent (well... Mello's not that innocent :]) people killed? Never! Just because they interfered was not a crime, except to Raito who had a God-complex and felt that any act against Kira was a crime, they were trying to do what they thought was right, and he had NO RIGHT to kill them. He's not God, it is NOT divine justice, and I'm seriously GLAD that he lost. Hmph.

*glomps kamiringo* You totally made my day with your post :D.

From the moment Light said, "and I will be the god of the new world," he started to leave his ideals behind. After all, you don't praise people who say they're a god, but throw them in the asylum. Especially when they start killing people. (And please do not bring up Jesus, or your god of choice: they didn't kill people.) While Light/Kira is not 'insane', it's clear that he's not fit to rule based on even this simple sentence that managed to show just how egocentric he had become. Plus there's the fact that not even petty criminals are judged by only one person, as had been said, and all of the innocent people killed. Not only had they done nothing wrong, as Mihael Keehl said, but the fact that he's destroying everything in his way, including a dear friend, and almost his own family, shows just how ruthless and cold he had become.

Raito and L... well, I'll just say that L has very unique ways of testing people :D.

I agree with the statement that Light/Kira doesn't want to kill innocent, and has fairly good reasons why. However, if you believe that he shouldn't have judged at all, then that means that the deaths are not justified, because they were killed so Kira could continue killing others.

A reformed Shinigami Realm? I couldn't ever see that happening. The shinigami generally do things for themselves, and would most likely not conform to "Kira's" ideals anytime soon. Truthfully, they don't even like writing in their Death Notes anyway, they're much to lazy and would rather just sit around gambling, like we saw them do in the first book.

'...'

"I suppose it is not impossible to assume that Ryuk will want to wait a while and then return to the human world, seeking out somebody like Light to have more fun with. Truly, that would be incredibly interesting. However, Ryuk may want to wait to Near dies. Do you think Ryuk would kill Near? No, that is out of character. Well, let us assume that sometime after Near dies, Ryuk returned to earth. Would he randomly drop the Note? Would people be more aware of what is happening? Eh, this IS off topic. I will create this thread in my Forum. Still, I think it is possible for Light to have an impact on the realm through my above outlined idea..."

Even if you do not agree with his way of doing things, how many people agree with Light Yagami's ideal?

(A world WITHOUT criminals.)

Any thoughts?

Personally, I believe crimes are committed because of people's desires. So those who commit crime in the presence of the law believe that their wants are more important than the penalty. Increasing the penalties wouldn't have that great of an effect, because some people would be willing to die for whatever it is they want. If an ideal world is possible, it would have to be done not by punishment, or fear, but by eliminating people's wants so they have no need to commit crimes to get whatever. Of course, that in itself would be impossible (unless you want to go the whole sci-fi route), so... *shrug*

As for the world after Kira, you would have a crime spree after that, because fear kept people back before, but the government's punishments are much less harsh, so criminals will feel like their risking much less.

Again, I hope that's coherent. ^^

I disagree slightly, I always assumed that a chiminal is simply an individual who believes abtaining something for his/herself and fullfilling his/her own desires are supperiour to attaining and fullfilling needs of society. Therefore, society's laws are created to keep people thinking of the socitey over themself; however, society allows for personal fun and fulfillment in order to prevent a person from feeling sealed to a fate. If a person felt trapped or feels to be in an unfair position, then that person would rebel. Therefore, if society is too strict, then a new society is created by a group rebelling against that society. Sometimes the rebels become a coexisting and sometimes it eats the society it rebels from. The only other conclusion is the controling society will crush the rebels who constantly be oppressed....eventually the rebels will win...well, for better or worse, that usually happens...

The successful rebellions are called "revolutions" However, we all knew that....

Anyway, I am wondering if their will be a rebellion. Perhaps the Kira Worshipers will rebel against the world governments...And even if it is not as succesful, let us assume they started to live to Kira's ideals...

If this happened, Near would be hunted thanks to the Kira Worshiper who saw Light's death. If Near died and therefore had no successor with Kira Worshippers ruling the world, then a Shinigami could "resurrect" Kira. Perhaps Ryuk...

Lawliet-san, you sound like my sociology and my psychology teachers o.O;;.

If Near's dead, and another Kira close to or at Light's ability level was found, then what would the world do, since the brightest of the Wammy's kids are dead...? Though if there's enough Kira supporters to start rebelling and kill off anti-Kira people, then do you think there'd be enough for the whole thing to morph into an actual war instead of an intellectual battle?

Well, Let us realize that if their was a new Kira, let us assume it was me. Knowing Light/Kira's ideals, I would alter them slightly. I would write all the criminals I can find down to die on a single day by Heart attack. People will realize instantly Kira is back. I will then kill just as Yagami did. From that point I would continue what Light did himself.

"Let us assume it was me." I find that funny. XD

But how would the world respond? Since they don't have their ace, then will they increase efforts? Surrender to Kira? Do you think another person would act as, or even be able to act as L or N did against Kira?

Wouldn't that be something if it was a girl? :3

Later.

Wammy house is in Winchester, England, yes :].

~Detective Lawliet

That was a response to "L" being a girl. I doubt that girl, under the conditions that Whammy house is taken care of, could be "L." It is MUCH more likely that a girl would become Kira. OO! What if someone from Whammy House became Kira after moving to the states. We will talk, WE MUST WRITE!!

He was accepted into a prestigious school, Ecole Militaire, and Light was admitted to an amazing university, To-Oh University, both the top in their fields of expertise. Skipping a few points in Napoleon's life that don't pertain to Light, he met Josephine, and incredibly beautiful woman who changed his life. In comparison, Misa did change Light's life, though not in the way Josephine changes Napoleon's (and that fact that she was intelligent, and Misa is merely above average.) Napoleon considered the relationship businesslike, whereas Josephine fell in love with Napoleon almost immediately; as you can see, the relationship is identical with Light and Misa. As his popularity grew as a brilliant military general, in the same way as Light's grew as Kira, people began to consider him godlike, the way Yagami was considered after getting his memories back when Higuchi was caught, the climax of L-Death Note arc, and this being close to the climax of Bonaparte's career. He did everything he could to get other men to follow him, and even though his army was rather ragtag his high confidence kept him completely away from the thought of losing at all. Light was the same way, with a matched ego and losing to L or Near or Mello never entered his thoughts. Napoleon's coronation as the Emperor of France was, in turn, like L's death. It was the ultimate show of power, the ultimate victory.

Light, by this point, never thought he could lose. He didn't think that he could lose, that he had everything he needed in the world. However, that’s when Mello and Near come in, of course. But before I can relate them, I have to state a few things about Misa and Josephine. Josephine couldn’t bear anymore children, and because she was useless to him he replaced her with the Archduchess of Austria, similar to the way Light replaced Misa with Kiyomi. Both Light and Napoleon showed signs of megalomania by this point, and were determined to replace loved ones or those closest to them if they lost their usefulness. And like Light, he downfall was led by a large number of various mistakes that could have been avoided if he was more careful, or spent more time thinking things through. But because he was so used to being right, it literally never occurred to him to make a possible plan in case he was wrong. Light as well.

So in comes Arthur Wellsly, more famously known as the Duke of Wellington, who is more or less the Mello and Near of Napoleon’s story. He lost to him the first time, which is about equal to Light having to send the Death Note off to Teru. Wellington had obsessed over Napoleonic warfare for years and was able to perfect an amazing counterattack against it, like how Mello was able to outsmart Light the first time around, when he got the Death Note. He lost the battle in Russia, Light lost the Note. However, he was able to make a complete comeback after a year’s exile (though for Light this is when he obtained the Note again), and was able to make it home to France. His march there was fabulous, he was able to get his army on his side again, and many volunteer men on his side as well. This would be similar to the Kira faction all over the world, and as well as Takada’s bodyguards. His regaining of power and the downfall of Louis XVIII was the equivalent of Mello’s death, and showed that he was not going to back down.

He recaptured his authority, however when he tried to defeat Britain, Prussia, and Belgium, things decidedly went downhill. This is similar to Light’s fight against Near. He tried and tried, but he was up against a tactical genius of his own caliber, Light was up against an intellectual of, basically, his own level of deduction and mind power. Napoleon brought in his final plan, going to see Near for Light, but was ultimately defeated at the Battle of Waterloo, and Light was killed when he met Near at the warehouse. Though it wasn’t by Near’s hand but Ryuk’s that he was killed, Bonaparte wasn’t killed by Wellington but a few months later back in exile after his 100 Days Reign. And before this entire story is really over, both Josephine and Misa are dead (Josephine while he was in exile and Misa after Light’s death, but nonetheless they both died.)

Heh, yeah, that was possibly me reading too far into things. But I thought it was really strange how the parallels worked there. And that fact that the general populace thought that both Napoleon Bonaparte and Yagami Light were stuff the Gods were made out of was what truly gave me ideas for the similarities between the two of them. I’m wasting too much time not doing homework, but this was eating a hole in my mind and I simply had to get it out there. So, tell me what you think! Was this completely silly, or do you think that I have a point, or whatever. I’d be extremely interested to hear what you have to say about my reasoning behind it. If it makes sense, tell me, please, or if it’s silly and doesn’t make any kind of sense at all, tell me too. I really did have a lot of fun doing it thought, hehe. :]

...

Fear my extreme nerdiness!! :D

*Clap.*

*Clap.*

Bravo! While this had no point nor a way to argue or be argued simply because of the depths of perception used in the observation. Indeed, I thought of this myself, and if you really want to compare genius' tactical error, compare Light's inability to come up with a back up plan to Napolean's error in ignoring the idea of steamboats. Many theorize that with those steam boats early on, he would have ACTUALLY TAKEN OVER THE WORLD.

I believe that more factors led to Light's downfall than Napoleon's, however, I am too tired to continue today. This one of the best parallels between fiction and reality that I have ever seen. As a conversation between the author of the book "Titan," which is very similair to the "Titanic" story but was written 28 years prior to the Titanic disaster, and his publisher went:

"Publisher: How many times must I tell you, no one wants to read of impossible fiction! Do you know the improbability of an 'unsinkable' ship, built by the finest boat makers in the world, sinking on its maiden voyage? Ridiculous! Give me facts!

The author: The only difference between fact and fiction is that fiction has not happened yet.:"

(Paraphrased!)

Why not let the world fall without him? It would give the feeling that the world cannot exist perfectly without him, which would seem appropriate that the death of a God is the death of the God's nation, for then, he was never a true God if the Nation can life without him.

I wonder why Light never considered the fact that even if he managed to make his perfect world, it would probably be corrupted within a generation after his death. Even if Mikami lived longer than Light and took over the role, he wouldn't be Kira long, as he is four years older than Light and would probably die soon after. Any heirs would be used to the peace, and probably wouldn't see the point of keeping up the criminal killings. Even if Kira's reign lasted long enough that people were able to accept that Kira is basically a normal person, I can't see that everyone would follow all the rules meekly. Most people, probably, but I could see a rebellion made of bored young people gathering quite easily. *shrug*

And while I am at it, here is why I don't like Near, he skips too many steps in his line of thinking. Like, how can he suspect Light of being Kira, still, when Light could not have killed Demegawa or planned that killing. To be honest, that stuff is what really ** me off. (And the ungodly belief that Mikami is a perfect candidate because he had met with Takada twice.UGH!)

I can't remember much of the volumes after five because I read them too fast, but since I have volume eleven on me...

Near does have a line of reasoning for suspecting Mikami:

Near says, "This is the guy I remembered as being completely onto Kira's ideals." and also that he sounded the same as the Kira in the recent message. Style, I mean. Plus the fact that Mikami says, "I believe that I am going to have to judge by myself what Kira's thought may be, and put them into action." Rather forward sounding for a typical Kira follower, wouldn't you think? So while the original criteria was, "Known by Takada, or vice versa," he does have reasoning with it.

And as for spotting Mikami, if my source is accurate (It is secondhand, forgive me. My computer can't handle DeathGod.org anymore...), Near has the special ability of watching many screens at once, or so the author said. Another theory is that because the sound of the tvs are specifically put in, he is listening to everything, and matched the voices. This was used to prove that Near could be albino, but it works in this case as well.

And I'm done. XD

Unfortunately, Near gave me new reason to hate him. BTW, I am actually fairly confused as to how people do not understand why Light went crazy. So...I am going to try and explain most of hi behavior...it will be in the Death section.

Anyway, your point is well taken, so I won't argue it directly unless I can find some new information. (Which will be difficult, unless I draw my own conclusions or put someone of Near's intellect through a similar challenge.

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